CNN Breaking News

Fourteen U.S. soldiers died Wednesday when their helicopter crashed in northern Iraq, according to the U.S. military.

Visit CNN for the latest.

24 Responses to “CNN Breaking News”

  1. Angrier and Angrier says:

    This is sad. I remember when this kind of thing used to be Earth shattering. Now it is just another day in Iraq.

  2. gahrie says:

    A&A:

    Actually, if you were paying attention, you’d know that this sort of thing happens all of the time in peace time also. In fact given modern weapons and tactics, peacetime training is almost as dangerous as war time service.

  3. Angrier and Angrier says:

    gahrie-

    The military is currently saying this is apparently an accident. However, if you have followed the other crashes like this, in a day or so that story may change.

  4. Joe Mama says:

    The military is currently saying this is apparently an accident. However, if you have followed the other crashes like this, in a day or so that story may change.

    Or that story may not change at all. I don’t know how many such accidents were later deemed not to be so (especially as a percentage), and I doubt anyone else does, either. Saying now that this story “may change” is pure conjecture and nothing more.

  5. ballin says:

    Gahrie- this would be front page news whether in peace time or Iraq. It is sad. It is unrealistic and callous to dismiss the death of soldiers in a war by saying that casualties happen in peacetime training, too. Them being in Iraq, among other things, was a butfor cause.

  6. Mike says:

    “Gahrie- this would be front page news whether in peace time or Iraq.”

    I disagree. Were any of these front page news?

    “Military Helicopter Crashes in Utah County”

    Marine Helicopter Crash Over Arizona Kills 4 People on Board”

    3 aviators declared dead in ocean crash”

    All “peacetime” aviation mishaps that happened in the past week. Yes, I understand that there’s a slight difference in numbers, but I can remember some large casualty “peacetime” aviation mishaps that weren’t front page news. The mishap at Fort Hood that killed a battalion commander a few years ago comes to mind.

    As for it being sad and callous, it is disingenuous to treat accidents as hostile fire incidents. Using that logic, we should think about pulling out of any sort of humanitarian operation as soon as a helo goes down for mechanical reasons because we are “taking casualties.”

  7. Angrier and Angrier says:

    There have been several instances where the Pentagon has said a copter has gone down due to mechanical failure only to come out days later to say it was hostile fire. Let’s not forget that these are the same folks who told you Pat Tillman died while he was charging up a ridge to take out the Taliban. These guys put out disinformation for as long as they can…and for what?

  8. Joe Mama says:

    There have been several instances where the Pentagon has said a copter has gone down due to mechanical failure only to come out days later to say it was hostile fire. Let’s not forget that these are the same folks who told you Pat Tillman died while he was charging up a ridge to take out the Taliban. These guys put out disinformation for as long as they can…and for what?

    And there have been many more instances where what the Pentagon initially said about a copter going down due to mechanical failure proved to be accurate. Pat Tillman was a unique case. I agree that there is no reason for the Pentagon to put out such “disinformation” in this instance, which is why I’m skeptical of your skepticism.

  9. Angrier and Angrier says:

    I didn’t say there was “no reason.” I said “for what?” I don’t know what that reason is, but it doesn’t seem like a very good one.

  10. Angrier and Angrier says:

    “BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) — Nightmarish political realities in Baghdad are prompting American officials to curb their vision for democracy in Iraq. Instead, the officials now say they are willing to settle for a government that functions and can bring security.”

    …You mean like the one we ousted?

  11. Joe Mama says:

    I didn’t say there was “no reason.” I said “for what?” I don’t know what that reason is, but it doesn’t seem like a very good one.

    You also don’t know if this is even a case of disinformation to begin with, so commenting on the merits of an as yet unidentified reason for such a hypothetical seems both silly and premature.

  12. Joe Mama says:

    You mean like the one we ousted?

    No, like one that isn’t ruled by a crazed sociopath who brazenly violates int’l law.

  13. gahrie says:

    I’m an Air Force brat. My Dad was a crewman on a helocopter in Vietnam that went out and picked up airplanes that got shot down so the VC couldn’t scrounge from them. I know the sacrifices the military and their families make in peace and war.

    The truth is the military is always a dangerous career.

  14. Mad Max, Esquire says:

    “No, like one that isn’t ruled by a crazed sociopath who brazenly violates int’l law.”

    Joe Mama. I’m surprised to hear you talking about Bush that way.

  15. David K. says:

    I’m not one to jump to this administrations defense, but AA you are being ridiculous. Yes its POSSIBLE that this was more than an accident, but it isn’t unreasonable to assume that it WAS just an accident. Millitary air travel isn’t without its hazards and as gahrie points out the military is a dangerous career in general. IF it turns out this was more than a simple crash and that is hidden from us for long then i’ll buy into your arguments, but while they have lost credibility in some areas, this is one i think your being a little harsh.

  16. Joe Mama says:

    I’m surprised to hear you talking about Bush that way.

    Oh, like no one saw Rosie O’Donnell here coming a mile away. Nice hustle, Max.

  17. Mad Max, Esquire says:

    Where’s Rosie? Is she there with you?

  18. Angrier and Angrier says:

    So now the military isn’t 100% sure it was a mechanical failure…

    “The military said initial indications were that the UH-60 helicopter had a mechanical problem and was not brought down by hostile fire, but the cause of the crash is under investigation.”

    …The chopper was extracting soldiers from a combat zone at night. It went down while it was trying to gain elevation. Give it a few days…

  19. Joe Mama says:

    A&A, hoping against hope . . .

  20. Sandy Underpants says:

    Any American who accepts what the US government tells them at face value either hasn’t been paying attention this decade or is on their side.

    Nobody cares about the soldiers and this thread is perfect evidence of that. One side uses their lives (deaths) as a reason we shouldn’t be at war and the other side dismisses their “sacrifice” (stupidity) by saying we lose the same amount of soldiers during peacetime.

    Lose-Lose.

  21. Anonymous says:

    Speak for yourself, pal.

  22. David K. says:

    AA, you really are looking like a nut job on this. Even if it DOES turn out to be related to hostile fire, that still doesn’t mean they were lying or misleading. They said it crashed, and that it appeared to be due to mechanical failure, but its standard procedure to investigate something like this for two reasons. One to figure out what caused the failure to prevent it in the future, two to make sure it was mechanical failure and not enemy fire. To cry conspiracy at something so unconspiratorial further removes any remaining shred of credibility you MIGHT have left.

  23. Mad Max, Esquire says:

    Whether or not A&A is right, questioning the intent/competence of the Pentagon PR people isn’t an accusation of conspiracy. The Pentagon has demonstrated over and over again its inability to get the story right the first time (Jessica Lynch? Pat Tillman? How many times was Saddam killed before he was actually killed?)

    I think the only “nut jobs” out there are those people who, after all this time, take Pentagon reports on face value. Where the fuck have you people been for four friggin’ years?

  24. Joe Mama says:

    Max,

    The Pentagon, with all its faults, still has a track record way better than yours, and one would have to be a nut job indeed to take your word over the Pentagon’s.